The Separation between State and Religion

In time we will realize that Democracy is the entitlement of individuals to every right that was in its times alloted to kings. The right to speak and decide, to be treated with decency, to serve and be served by people in a State of “love” that is, to serve with one’s work for the development of ‘life’. To belong to the Kingdom of Human Beings without racial, national, social or academic separations. To love and be loved. To die at the service of the whole and be honored in one’s death, for one’s life and work was legitimately valued. To be graceful and grateful. To have the pride and the humility of being One with the Universe, One with every realm of Existence, One with every living and deceased soul. To treat with dignity and be treated with dignity for One is dignified together with All others and Life itself. To walk the path of compassion, not in the sorrow of guilt but in the pride of being. To take responsability for one’s mistakes and sufferings and stand up again and again like a hero and a heroine and face the struggle that is put at one’s feet and in one’s hands. Millions of people, millions and millions of people might take many generations to realize the consciousness of our humaneness but there is no other dignified path for the human being.

The “work” as I conceive it is psychological and political. Psychology is the connection between the different dimensions within one’s self and Politics is the actualization of that consciousness in our practical lives. Religion is the ceremony that binds the connectedness between the individual and the Universe. The separation between religion, politics and science, the arts and sports is, in the sphere of the social, the reflection of the schizophrenia within the individual and the masses. The dialogue between individuality and the "human" belongs to consciousness. The tendency to develop cults resides in the shortcomings we’are finding in life as it is structured today. “Life” has become the private property of a few priviledged who cannot profit from it because as soon as it is appropriated it stops to be “life” or “life-giving”.

We are all the victims of our own invention and each one is called upon to find solutions. The only problem is believing our selves incapable of finding them. We are now free to use all Systems of knowledge objectively, sharing them without imposing our will on each other. To become objective about our lives means to understand that the institutions that govern its experience are critically important. That we are one with the governments, one with the religious activities that mark its pace, that the arena’s in which we move our bodies and the laboratories in which we explore our possibilities are ALL part and parcel of our own personal responsibility. That WE ARE ONE WITH EACH OTHER AND EVERYTHING AROUND US and acknowledge for ourselves a bond of love in conscious responsibility. That we human beings know ourselves part of each other and are willing and able to act on our behalf for the benefit of each and every individual. That we no longer allow governments, industries, universities or any other institution to run along unchecked by the objective principles of humaneness. That we do not allow gurus to abuse their power or governors to steal the taxes and use them to their personal advantage in detriment of the whole. That we do not allow abuse from anyone anywhere because life is too beautiful to do so and that we are willing to stop the rampant crime with the necessary compassion Conscious knowledge is every individual's right. Conscious action is every individual's duty.

Blog Archive

Monday 24 May 2010

Ton-Elena May 24

16 Ton


e: “What seems to offend you so badly is that I think I understand a few things. On the one hand you agree that I’m right and on the other you state that I’m wrong because I think I’m right. Is that so that you can be right and nobody else? Find a place where you can stand and push the others out?”




print this out, go to the mirror now and use these words for the exercise i recommended… a clear example of the above is the reaction you have on the few occasions we’ve found common ground…. reflect this back onto yourself… think about it.
e: “You can’t even inspire trust….”
yes elena, trust is a major issue with you… i know, i’ve been there too. after the cult experience and divorce(s) it takes years and years to develop a healthy level of trust… the untimely death of your mother has a lot to do with your lack of trust. i have indicated to you that this is not the right place for this kind of work, that you really should seek out the proper venue and professional help to process this stuff… at least you have finally acknowledged (at the end of the previous page) that you have to be able to help yourself before you can help others, and so i’m willing to lend you a helping hand while you muster up the courage and the trust to find a better way of helping yourself.
as for the rest of the post, you are simply chasing your own tail elena, this resolves nothing, it only perpetuates the vicious circle you’ve created for yourself.
17 Elena
Keep avoiding the facts Ton and you’ll get to heaven, like Robert!
At the end of the last page what I said was that if I can’t help you to have a decent enough dialogue or anyone else, I can at least help myself by avoiding to have one with you.
You misinterpreted that and thought I was conceding anything to you? How presumptous but it’s so common in you: you isolate a sentence from a whole post and distort it as you please never actually bothering to listen to the message. Like my Girard and Robert and the whole lot of them. Have you really left the cult? What’s the difference then?
You pretend to heal a patient with the virus and don’t know when the patient is getting better. Keep up your practice Ton but with somebody else.
Like Robert, you’re convinced that you’ve got the truth but lie as badly as he does and have an equal inability as him to actually engage with me in a positive dialogue acknowledging not only what you say but what I say. Who else could it remind you of?
You poor guy, you have to stay here pretending you’re trying to help me so that you try to erase what you did in the fofblog and can’t even apologize for it. Like Robert who never apologizes for anything he does although he hurts so many people.
I’ve really had enough of you Ton. It’s time to move on. You’ve made tremendous progress: at least you don’t use your ridiculing tone anymore but besides that you’re as closed up to your own vision as Robert and I already supported him long enough to do that with you or anyone else.
You make up new excuses as we go along.
At the beginning it was that I had to research more, then it was that I was sick and playing the victim and now your story is that you’re here to help me. You might believe your made up stories but anyone else with a less infected mind can see through them clearly.
It’s so easy when you make and manipulate the rules as you go along and avoid whatever pleases you thinking nobody else sees it.
But since I just consider that dishonest I am really not in the mood for further repetitions of the same vicious circle. I don’t think I have forgiven you or want to forgive you and that alone makes anything very difficult. So why don’t you take your winnings and go home? With bets like that I’d rather not play.
18 Elena
This is the post you’re referring to. Nowhere does it say that I acknowledge anything that you’ve suggested, on the contrary, it says that I’ve given up on trying to have a dialogue with you.
Yes Ton, I’m afraid such truths are always a little offensive for the ego and we should be able to look at them for what they are. I kindly ask you to allow me to retire from this conversation because I sincerely find it boring and dishonest.
This new tone of kindness was what I needed three, two, one year ago and you’re Oh so late by now Ton and you’re right, I don’t care anymore. I find you dishonest and out of place.
All those things you mention: my mother, my husbands, the cult are Oh so true, they hurt for so long but I’ve found my way out of that suffering and how I’ve been doing that is all here in these blogs if you bothered to read what matters but you’re fixed in the idea of Elena the victim. You’ve been trying to convince me for so long that you managed to convince yourself and are crystallizing in it. If you like that go ahead. At this point you could be getting off on a potato and it wouldn’t matter to me. Besides the human compassion I might feel for anyone so wrapped up in his own labyrinth, I fully understand that you’re free to chose and if I can neither help you nor anyone else, I can at least help my self.
Goodbye Ton.
19 Ton
elena, what is evident in your posts is the pain you are in. i feel so much pain, hostility and anger coming from you. i forgive you for the negativity that you are directing at me, even though your intention is to hurt and insult me, i forgive you because the anger you feel toward me is coming from the pain you are in, your pain, your anger, your hostility, your general negativity is no reflection on me, rather it is a reflection of your own pain… as a fellow human being, what else can i feel for you but compassion for the pain you’re living with.
elena, i wish you well.
20 Elena
I’ve been like that for three years Ton and you’ve been attacking that for that length of time and supporting others who do it. At first you were very supportive and when others started attacking and I attacked back and called you cheap sick sisssys who are too numbed to stand up against a cult that you know is harming people badly, when I pointed out each and everyone of your weaknesses with women, and children and society you too turned your back on me. You have relished yourself in taking advantage of my vulnerability and made all the fun and the attacks that were available to you and justified that with insults and ridiculing and banning. Now that you see it for what it is you are going to pretend to be experiencing compassion? Is that your new face? You who knew very well what my condition in returning to the fofblog was and who support behaviors like that of Bruce and Zannos and all those who were so kind after Steve banned me are going to tell me that you are feeling compassion when you’ve been here ridiculing and making fun of everything I say for over a month and only when I tell you it’s over you’re kind so that your little game doesn’t stop? You haven’t had enough of it yet?
What you people are most afraid of is someone’s innocence. You can’t bear to look at it without destroying it which is what you just did in the fofblog and what you couldn’t bear in my first participation there.
My innocence in saying that We are One and that being human is the only thing that matters. That is what you can’t bear and now that I’ve separated my self from you and no longer care, you are feeling compassion? For my self or yours? Don’t bother to respond. I don’t think I want to hear you anymore.
21 Elena



Ton: “i forgive you because the anger you feel toward me is coming from the pain you are in, your pain, your anger, your hostility, your general negativity is no reflection on me, rather it is a reflection of your own pain”
Don’t you dare manipulate and play with the anger I feel or turn it around in any way to fit your pictures Ton. I am not asking for your forgiveness nor do I forgive you.
The anger I am feeling and have felt all along is simple and clear: We were fucked thrice by a cult and we know it is still doing it to many other people and I attacked each and everyone who pretends to justify his or her actions to not take responsibility for THAT. THAT Ton, THAT is my anger. You come and attack me and pretend that the only thing that’s wrong with me is that I am sick so that you can cover up what I’ve been saying all along and not HEAR IT because you CAN’T BEAR IT and you behave like a sad little sadist post after post trying to belittle everything I say.
You’ve won Ton, take your winnings and go home because what you got is what you came for. Go with your head high back to the fofblog and tell them how much you’ve managed to shame me ridiculing me with each post and how successful you’ve been in showing me how insignificant and sick I am that you will not give me an account of anything I ask of you because you are so strong and healthy and sane. Isn’t THAT what you came for?
My pain Ton is not one I am ashamed of as you so consistently have tried to convince me. I am very proud of my pain and my capacity to feel it. It belongs with my innocence and over the years in these blogs it has understood so very much where the real illness is. If what I have is illness I hope it kills me because life isn't worth living without it. Don’t you dare try to take it away from me. You are people who’ve allowed life to shun your innocence, your wildness, your love and your highest understanding and exclude from your club someone who states with complete innocence and at the same time full conviction that We are One, that we can’t allow for people to continue to get hurt without doing something about it, that we’re all rather sick in our times and need to help each other. That is what you people are banning and what you’re ridiculing in each of your posts justifying your lowliness as if it were divine, just like Robert Burton does.
We are One still but if you’re so happy separating people from that Oneness, let me sit with my self and rest without you until you care to come around.
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